What’s Up with the charging speeds ?

Faults and Technical chat for the Volkswagen ID.3
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Jel
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2020 12:58 pm

What’s Up with the charging speeds ?

Post by Jel » Fri Nov 20, 2020 2:05 pm

So today I tested two chargers. One 50kW and a the other was a 150kW (ID3 should except a 100kW) charge

Both charged at a slow current (reduced charging current was not on). The 50kW charger took 60mins to go from 37% to 50% and the 150kW took 30mins from 50% to 75%. Both times the AC was off and the 50kW showed a speed on the display off 70mph and the 150kW showed a max of 180mph.

On a 100kW charger you should get from 0-100% in and hour so what’s up ?

ID3 Family (Pro) 58KWh UK model

Sindidziwa
Posts: 22
Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2020 4:06 pm

Re: What’s Up with the charging speeds ?

Post by Sindidziwa » Fri Nov 20, 2020 3:30 pm

180 mph is equivalent to about 50 kW I think (at an exchange rate of 4 miles/kW so maybe the charger was throttled back? I charged at an infinity station (up to 350 kW) and only got the same rate as you because it was free rather than the 69p/kW. I couldn't find a way to charge faster and use up my free allowance!

Jel
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2020 12:58 pm

Re: What’s Up with the charging speeds ?

Post by Jel » Fri Nov 20, 2020 4:11 pm

Thanks for the replay Sindidziwa. I'll pay more attention to what the charger shows its outputting on the display next time. I wish VW would show the input kW instead of MPH speed which makes no sense.

hwhbev
Posts: 12
Joined: Sat Oct 17, 2020 6:48 pm

Re: What’s Up with the charging speeds ?

Post by hwhbev » Fri Nov 20, 2020 4:53 pm

Jel wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 2:05 pm
Both charged at a slow current (reduced charging current was not on). The 50kW charger took 60mins to go from 37% to 50% and the 150kW took 30mins from 50% to 75%. Both times the AC was off and the 50kW showed a speed on the display off 70mph and the 150kW showed a max of 180mph.
For the 50kW charger to go from 37% to 50% in one hour means it was charging at 7.5kW not 50kW. This is more akin to home charging speeds.

For the 150kW charger to go from 50% to 75% in half an hour means it was charging at 29kW not 150kW.

Above about 80% the car's battery management will start throttling the charging current to avoid over heating the battery so you can't assume it will go from 0% to 100% in 2.5 hours on a 150kW charger. It will go to 80% in two hours and than start slowing down.

This is all theory and, yes, I know the battery capacity is slightly more than the rated 58kWh. I haven't had my ID.3 long enough to do any rapid charging. Lockdown doesn't help. "I'm just testing my EV, officer" probably wouldn't be regarded as a reasonable excuse to leave home. ;)

scott28tt
Posts: 111
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2020 2:34 pm

Re: What’s Up with the charging speeds ?

Post by scott28tt » Fri Nov 20, 2020 6:09 pm

This is an ID3 plugged into a 100kW charger - the State of Charge makes a huge difference:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/pZWTBkTDwSFZqf1y8

Jel
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2020 12:58 pm

Re: What’s Up with the charging speeds ?

Post by Jel » Fri Nov 20, 2020 7:09 pm

hwhbev wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 4:53 pm
Jel wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 2:05 pm
Both charged at a slow current (reduced charging current was not on). The 50kW charger took 60mins to go from 37% to 50% and the 150kW took 30mins from 50% to 75%. Both times the AC was off and the 50kW showed a speed on the display off 70mph and the 150kW showed a max of 180mph.
For the 50kW charger to go from 37% to 50% in one hour means it was charging at 7.5kW not 50kW. This is more akin to home charging speeds.

For the 150kW charger to go from 50% to 75% in half an hour means it was charging at 29kW not 150kW.

Above about 80% the car's battery management will start throttling the charging current to avoid over heating the battery so you can't assume it will go from 0% to 100% in 2.5 hours on a 150kW charger. It will go to 80% in two hours and than start slowing down.

This is all theory and, yes, I know the battery capacity is slightly more than the rated 58kWh. I haven't had my ID.3 long enough to do any rapid charging. Lockdown doesn't help. "I'm just testing my EV, officer" probably wouldn't be regarded as a reasonable excuse to leave home. ;)

I wonder if some ID3s have been throttled back in terms of charging. At least until all the issues are sorted out. I will test taking my ID3 down to 20% and the rapid charge it to see what the charge rate is.

NorwichComputersAndy
Posts: 22
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2020 8:42 pm

Re: What’s Up with the charging speeds ?

Post by NorwichComputersAndy » Mon Nov 23, 2020 10:42 pm

I went to a “super charger” (50KW) the other day. It was a pod point and really morbid curiosity of charge speeds and got 30.5KWH in 39 minutes. Was set to charge to 80% so around 10% to 80%.

Kind of inline with the 0-80% times VW state in a 100KW charger ✅

538BB31D-03A0-47D7-867A-79552457191A.png


Coopear
Posts: 15
Joined: Tue Nov 10, 2020 12:59 pm

Re: What’s Up with the charging speeds ?

Post by Coopear » Thu Nov 26, 2020 3:31 pm

Ok, I’m writing this while I sit plugged into an ionity rapid charger (capable of upto 350kW), charging at around 60kW. I thought I’d phone them up and ask why it wasn’t maxing out at 100kW...

Turns out there’s a few potential reasons. Optimum charging speed relies on several things:
- a battery <20% or >80% will be charged slower
- battery temperature. Ionity describe the optimum is to have been driving at highway speeds for 30 or 40 minutes prior to arriving at the charge point ensures battery is warm.
- external temperature, optimum is 15 to 25C

I missed all the above so maybe 60 isn’t too bad. I might try preconditioning the battery at home next time and see if it improves.

Jel
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2020 12:58 pm

Re: What’s Up with the charging speeds ?

Post by Jel » Thu Nov 26, 2020 3:37 pm

Coopear wrote:
Thu Nov 26, 2020 3:31 pm
Ok, I’m writing this while I sit plugged into an ionity rapid charger (capable of upto 350kW), charging at around 60kW. I thought I’d phone them up and ask why it wasn’t maxing out at 100kW...

Turns out there’s a few potential reasons. Optimum charging speed relies on several things:
- a battery <20% or >80% will be charged slower
- battery temperature. Ionity describe the optimum is to have been driving at highway speeds for 30 or 40 minutes prior to arriving at the charge point ensures battery is warm.
- external temperature, optimum is 15 to 25C

I missed all the above so maybe 60 isn’t too bad. I might try preconditioning the battery at home next time and see if it improves.
Let us know the results of your preconditioning test. When I charge mine its was below 15c and I had been driving in town slowly so the battery would not have been warm.

Jel
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2020 12:58 pm

Re: What’s Up with the charging speeds ?

Post by Jel » Sat Nov 28, 2020 10:41 am

Think I found the answer ( https://phys.org/news/2018-08-ev-cold-t ... ivers.html )

I drive 99% of the time in London with an average speed of 10mph :? That makes me think that the HV battery never really warms up and when I go to a charging point the input current's reduced by the cars onboard systems. I'm also assuming that if you drive at higher speeds where the HV battery is warmer then the charge current would be closer to the maximum output of the charging point

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