Totally dead

All Volkswagen ID.3 related discussions
OllyExeterID3
Posts: 67
Joined: Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:45 pm

Post by OllyExeterID3 »

Folkramfer wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 7:31 am I'm a bit bemused as to why you need a lead acid battery. Its adding all that extra weight and taking up space. If vw felt the need for extra electric capacity why did they not put in a slightly higher rated main battery. I'm sure any need for reserve power, segregation of supply and voltage differences could have been handled electronically. Oops! VW aren't too good at electronics these days.
Agree with this - I wonder if there is a practical reason why a lead acid battery is needed. Any engineers/electricians who can shed light on this? Not sure it is to do with battery chemistry/design that means that auxiliaries are better run from lead acid or not.

Either way, we got through out 2.1 update the other day so fingers crossed this will never be a problem for us. But, as we rarely use the car daily, I think I am going to be always a little worried!

G43FAN

Post by G43FAN »

All BEVs have a 12volt battery even the gods that are Tesla are only just looking at moving to Lithium based batteries to replace the Lead Acid.. It's not a VW thing.

1. To ensure that in the event of a main battery failure there is still braking and hazard functionality.
2. To trigger the main battery back to life otherwise it would have to be on all the time
3. To avoid a vampire drain from electrical systems killing the main battery completely
and others..
HeidiFlowerpt Driver
Posts: 251
Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2020 2:30 pm

Post by HeidiFlowerpt Driver »

Also I believe the electronics are run from the 12V battery rather than the HV array.
ID.3 1st Edition Manganese Grey - called Heidi Flowerpot
thefordprefect
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2021 2:59 pm

Post by thefordprefect »

the vehicle battery is around 400 volts fully charged. they would need a medium power convertor to reduce this voltage down to the 12 volts/3volts/5volts to run the electronics and lights. This may introduce failures as 400volts is/was a tricky voltage for most commercial electronics. And perhaps more relevant would be safety of breaking steering etc if the 400v battery is depleted. there is also power loss in the convertor and possibly having to route high voltage dc lines round the vehicle..
I understand the need for the battery. I do not understand why they cannot maintain the battery and why they cannot switch everything off when the vehicle is off. When I was working on power assisted steering electronics there were very tough specifications on the off (quiescent) current (less than 1/1000 of Amp (1mA) I think!). The power assistance requirement was around 50Amps so that would be a heavy load for a convertor!
Folkramfer
Posts: 64
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:23 pm

Post by Folkramfer »

I reckon the systems are just not developed enough to rely on single power source. I'm sure that we'll see the demise of an auxiliary battery in the not too distant future.
Sindidziwa
Posts: 84
Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2020 4:06 pm

Post by Sindidziwa »

scott28tt wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 2:19 pm Once it's on 2.0 or later the car monitors the 12V and tops it up from the "drive" batteries if needed, in theory you shouldn't get a repeat.
Unfortunately, my 12V problems have only arisen _after_ being upgraded to 2.1 (0792) - secondtimme showing 'drive to charge' message despite driving 80+ miles yesterday...
Sheila
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue May 11, 2021 10:24 pm

Post by Sheila »

After 7 months of having the ID.3 1st Plus with sw 2.1 (0792), it would seem that I am now having issues with the battery. I don't know for sure because I did not get any warnings and had even driven it with no issues over the 2 days prior, but when I unlocked the door and sat in it Tuesday morning, I could not shift it to D/B or R (I did double tap on the brakes as usual to start it, but nothing happened this time). In the end, we got the road assist truck to come by and tow it to the VW workshop that is luckily just a 5 min walk from where I live. Before towing it away, the road assist mechanic tried to disconnect the 12V battery and reconnect it again. This created all imaginable error codes to show up, and though it went back to normal in the end, the car stubbornly still remained in (P)ark.

Due to Ascension Day this week, VW said they can get back to me only on Monday, so yeah...let's see what they say. My car has been to the workshop around 7-8 times already, mainly because they still can't seem to get the keyless access feature to work (the only keyless thing I can do is to lock the door by touching the handle). So hopefully they will be able to fix these two issues when they return the car back. Good thing my car is leased, so if all kinds of issues continue to persist, I can stop the leasing contract after September. It is otherwise a fantastic car to drive in, so I don't hope it comes to that.
G4XUR
Posts: 46
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2021 11:15 pm

Post by G4XUR »

Having suffered the same issues I am concluding the battery (12v) has become knackered with abnormal discharges below the battery manufacturers stated limits on numerous times, which after after the 2.1 update; is capacity degraded even though 2.1ensures the 12v battery gets a little charge when the HV battery is being charged. I measured it across the battery terminals as over 16v which suggests the battery impedance is far higher than a normal battery specification (knackered 12v battery). I got mine swapped out for a new one a month ago and all is now well. Well, I used the ID3 at the weekend and next time will be tomorrow!! hope all is ok! VW have lost their reliability reputation with this one and the ID4. Such a shame for VW as was.
Matthewwoolf
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2021 8:29 pm

Post by Matthewwoolf »

To add my experience here today I had the 2nd occurrence of a dead 12v battery and the AA had to recover the car.

I’m gutted and really upset about this issue and going to be engaging a lawyer to try and understand how to resolve this issue. Ideally I want a return snd refund. Unless there is a proper fix to constantly think your car will not start makes it unfit for purpose.
ID3 Life Pro - 2021
Matthewwoolf
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2021 8:29 pm

Post by Matthewwoolf »

As an update to my post I have now had VW confirm there is a part that needs replacing ( I believe this to be a transformer between the 12v battery and the car). It was due to arrive today however VW UK put a stop to the delivery stating that the part is faulty and its going through a re-design or re-programming (they were not clear). Either way I wont get another update until later in the week but clearly there is an issue here!
ID3 Life Pro - 2021
Sheila
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue May 11, 2021 10:24 pm

Post by Sheila »

There is a part that needs replacing in my car too. Think it's the gear control, which seems to be consistent with the solution provided to others who have the same issue as me. Not sure if it's connected to the 12V battery in my case since VW didn't mention it. But yeah, a replacement part has been ordered, but I've been told that it is unknown when it will arrive. For now, I have a loaner car (first an ID.3 1st Performance, and today, they changed it to an ID.4 Performance since they had apparently sold the first loaner car). They have put us down for 3 weeks with the loaner car this time, and our car has been at the workshop now for 14 days... .
Waldemar
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2021 3:25 pm

Post by Waldemar »

My ID3 has the same battery problem. Car was uk registered in May 2021. Garage VW Johnsons in Solihull cant see it until 17 Jan 2023 as they have 1 trained ID technician only and are apparently the only garage with an ID technician encompassing an area between Birmingham, Shrewsbury and Liverpool! If thats true its shameful. They have queues of ID3 owners with their cars waiting to be seen! I eventually got a response after Johnsons suggested I ring VW Assistance. Within a couple of hours an AA van pulled up outside my house and the engineer did a few checks on my 12v battery and diagnosed it was totally flat at 0.0Volts! He got his booster out and 10 minutes later, Viola! All errors disappeared. Used my 12volt battery charger to bring battery up to 100% charged.
My only issue now is that my 12v battery will discharge 50% from full overnight. That means unless I drive it regularly, it will leak power and go flat again!
I've bought a booster. Come on VW! This has been going on, according to the ID3 forum, since 2020! Why haven't you sorted it and recalled all affected cars!
WW
G43FAN

Post by G43FAN »

I assume you haven't had the 2.4 update, is the appointment on the 17th to complete tha? If not have you tried any other dealer franchise in the area?
Has anyone had any success with getting a replacement battery of similar type put in the car even as a temporary stop gap?
Waldemar
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2021 3:25 pm

Post by Waldemar »

In reply to G43Fan, yes my car is software ver 2.4. Although VW says its 2.4 my car says its 2.3. Still they confirmed it was definitely 2.4. It got updated in October 22 and I got it back after about 4 weeks. In fairness after 1 week they gave me a courtesy after first week. I've been charging my ID3 every other night. Its in the garage on Tuesday 17th so hope they sort it.
WW
G43FAN

Post by G43FAN »

That is a bit odd, early cars that had 12v battery discharge issues were fixed via much earlier software updates,
The 2.4 Update was to replace the 12v battery as much as anything so you should have a newer more robust battery.

I would also say "In fairness"? No 2.4 was a recall and the email from VW makes it clear you should get alternative transport should you require it.

and Yes, the car still says 2.3 the important thing to look for is Version 0912 lower down.
KelvinForce9
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Jan 16, 2023 4:24 pm

Post by KelvinForce9 »

SOFTWARE UPGRADES:- We delivered our id3 1st Edition, in full working order, to the local dealer for its first service on 05 December and the car is still with them due to repeated software upgrade related problems.
The first problem appears to have been caused by the new software (V2.4) not recognising the reversing camera as our car had been fitted with an assembly made for the VW Golf. Eventually the camera was replaced and the upgrade to V2.4 completed on 06 January 2013.
However, as my wife and I are both 73 years old and incapable of making the over the air upgrade to V3.0 the dealer agreed to make the upgrade on our behalf but this failed and today we were told that they were unable to guarantee the drivability of the vehicle.
What does this mean; they have broken our car rendering unserviceable plus they are unable to give any indication of when they can fix the problem.
How can VW expect its owners to undertake upgrading the vehicle software when it appears that their own agents are incapable?
As a side issue I contacted VW Customer Service and was given no help whatsoever other than a complaint number and being told that in situations like this they had no authority and/or responsibility and the Dealer was solely responsible for resolving the matter.
It used to be that a car service was an oil & filter change plus a rub down with an oily rag but now days its a software upgrade hoping that it does not leave your car unserviceable as in our case.
VW have got to do better; we have owned 3 x Toyota Hybrids and 4 x Lexus Hybrids with no problems and certainly nothing related with software upgrades.
It was not so long ago that we complained about Microsoft using its customers to debug its Windows operating systems; however, unlike a computer a car has the potential to kill. Note the actions of Boeing when, recently, they withdrew the 737 Max8 from service due to to issues with its software.
Scratch
Posts: 1166
Joined: Thu Jul 15, 2021 3:22 pm

Post by Scratch »

KelvinForce9 wrote: Mon Jan 16, 2023 4:58 pm SOFTWARE UPGRADES:- We delivered our id3 1st Edition, in full working order, to the local dealer for its first service on 05 December and the car is still with them due to repeated software upgrade related problems.
The first problem appears to have been caused by the new software (V2.4) not recognising the reversing camera as our car had been fitted with an assembly made for the VW Golf. Eventually the camera was replaced and the upgrade to V2.4 completed on 06 January 2013.
However, as my wife and I are both 73 years old and incapable of making the over the air upgrade to V3.0 the dealer agreed to make the upgrade on our behalf but this failed and today we were told that they were unable to guarantee the drivability of the vehicle.
What does this mean; they have broken our car rendering unserviceable plus they are unable to give any indication of when they can fix the problem.
How can VW expect its owners to undertake upgrading the vehicle software when it appears that their own agents are incapable?
As a side issue I contacted VW Customer Service and was given no help whatsoever other than a complaint number and being told that in situations like this they had no authority and/or responsibility and the Dealer was solely responsible for resolving the matter.
It used to be that a car service was an oil & filter change plus a rub down with an oily rag but now days its a software upgrade hoping that it does not leave your car unserviceable as in our case.
VW have got to do better; we have owned 3 x Toyota Hybrids and 4 x Lexus Hybrids with no problems and certainly nothing related with software upgrades.
It was not so long ago that we complained about Microsoft using its customers to debug its Windows operating systems; however, unlike a computer a car has the potential to kill. Note the actions of Boeing when, recently, they withdrew the 737 Max8 from service due to to issues with its software.
Judging by the number of people who are having issues with the ID range, it is probably about time that trading standards became involved. Is there still a TV programme like “Watchdog”? VW need to be “prodded” into waking up about these issues. The VW customer support is “not fit for purpose”, and certainly aren’t anything like a support department should be. I wonder, also, if VW realise they can get away with pretty much anything they like with the Brits, since Brexit.
G43FAN

Post by G43FAN »

As it was a 1st had it had the 2.0(?), 2.1 and 2.3 updates already, if so 2.3 was OTA. Also was this a retro fitted Reversing camera?

There should be nothing complicated abuot the software update. The car downloads the software in the background using it's own eSim and then when it's ready you click the screen to update. I don't understand how your age should prevent you being able to do it. Was it made clear to you that the 3.0 update is not actually on general release yet?

Every time I see someone suggest the dealer has agreed to install 3.0 it doesn't seem to go well.
KelvinForce9
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Jan 16, 2023 4:24 pm

Post by KelvinForce9 »

We are unsure of the version of software when the care was sent in for its first service; since buying the car we are unaware of any software updates and were told by the dealer that they had attempted to install V2.4 along with the 12v battery upgrade. As far as we know the camera was a factory fitted item. The reversing camera was found to be the cause of the failure to upgrade to V2.4 and VW tech. support gave them the part number of an id4 camera whereas the id3 camera is integrated in the boot catch module. Once they received and replaced the complete id3 boot catch module they were able to complete the upgrade to V2.4.
The technicians at the dealer are qualified to work on an id3 and as the pervious software upgrades were dealer installed who better to make the upgrade to v3.0; an experienced operator or a person who knows enough about it to be dangerous. Both my wife and I have problems with our mobile phones and ill equipped to attack a job of this magnitude. It is dangerous for VW to ask its customers to interfere in the inner most workings of the car.
G43FAN

Post by G43FAN »

3 posts (1 of which is a duplicate) and making personal insults, haven't got time for people like you mate.. bye bye
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