Would you do it again?

All Volkswagen ID.3 related discussions
sclrkuk
Posts: 32
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2021 6:00 pm

Post by sclrkuk »

I'm currently driving an i3 (with range extender) which has been trouble free since I got it 2.5 years ago. I hadn't considered getting a new car until I spotted a really good PCP deal on the ID.3 at my local VW dealership. I ordered a Life in early January, and delivery is due to happen in February.

Before the i3, I had an e-Golf for 3 years, so I'm not new to EVs, but reading this forum and the list of faults, I am wondering if I'm better keeping the i3 until July when the current lease ends, and by which time VW may have sorted the ID.3 issues.

My question is, if you have an ID.3, with the benefit of hindsight would you rather have waited, or are you happy with your car?
Last edited by sclrkuk on Tue Jan 19, 2021 2:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
VW ID.3 Life

OllyExeterID3
Posts: 67
Joined: Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:45 pm

Post by OllyExeterID3 »

Hi sclrkuk,

Overall, I would recommend the I.D3 but it comes with caveats. As a fellow i3 owner who has just recently got an I.D.3, here is my rundowns in terms of pros/cons based on being an i3 driver:

Pros:
Range - even in winter, the range is still miles more the the i3 and this was one of the big attractions - we are more likely to do fewer, longer journeys so having this was a great sell.

Faults - I have not experienced any from my Life and the car performs pretty well actually. Despite some features not being available, I believe this is now being patched with the long term update which should apply to yours too.

Driving experience - It takes a while to get used to the 'D' and 'B' driving modes as it is different in driving style to the i3 but the handling is amazing, it feels much more confident around corners and the 'smart' regen means you can adapt your driving to the circumstances

Cabin comfort - The i3 has a premium cabin but the overall space and calm design of the cabin in the I.D3 matches this easily - it is both fun and calming to drive and covers long distances easily.

Heating - Feels more efficient and quicker to get to temperature than the i3, which makes pre-conditioning easier and winter driving more pleasant.

Cons:
Interior finish - 'Cheaper' than the BMW, lots of plastic and nowhere near the level of premium quality experienced with our i3.

Regen - Weaker than the i3 by a long way - coasting is the standard, B mode gets close to one-pedal but coasts under 4mph. Takes a lot of getting used to on country roads and windier stretches.

Touchscreen - Not a huge issue but I wish I had known a bit more about the fact that everything is controlled on here - not really any way of shortcut keys or physical buttons (like on the i3 where you can set numbers to commands).

App - Currently not at all as good as the i3 - no performance metrics, no ability to set charge times (though this is coming in the update), limited features and glitchy.


Overall I am happy I didn't wait as the teething problems aren't big enough to warrant waiting. I believe most of the issues will be fixed with models rolling out from now onwards.

What I wish I had known is that the two key features I love about the i3 (one-pedal driving and the app) are limited on the I.D3 which, for me living in rural Devon and spending a lot of time on country roads that are great with regen, was something I missed for a little bit! Neither were disappointing enough to make me regret it though!
Deleted User 192

Post by Deleted User 192 »

I can't do in i3 comparison, but the above comments specific to the ID3 are very fair.

Mine has been back to the workshop for a couple of hardware tweaks and a good number of software-related matters resolved with updates - but to answer your question in terms of everything related to the car itself I would absolutely do it again!

It's not a Golf, it's a million miles away from the C-class I had before - it's a car in it's own right with it's own identity.
Kaygee
Posts: 47
Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2021 11:35 am

Post by Kaygee »

I had read a lot of reviews on the ID.3 and therefore a lot of the issues with software problems, but that did not put me off purchasing.
This is my first EV and I did research other options but the ID.3 for the price stood out above the others. And I haven't been disappointed.
Your vehicle may well be supplied with the ME2.0 (0783) software update, in which case the earlier teething problems could be resolved, That just means having to wait for the 2.1 update March/April.
ColinID3
Posts: 55
Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2021 10:10 am

Post by ColinID3 »

I would absolutely do it again.
I have been planning for a while that when the time came I'd buy an EV as my first new car. I wasn't thinking the time had come when I walked into my VW dealer in December to see the ID3, but financially the deals that were available at the end of the year were unbelievable so I took the plunge and haven't regretted it for a moment.
They still seem to be very good VFM now. I think my mid year, post Software 2.1 and when the reputation goes beyond the small glitches we are working through now, prices will harden significantly.

Take a look at pre-registered cars from end of last year (Autotrader had 276 listed the other day). Many dealers had to register cars to meet bonuses from VW. Amazing prices.
Life Pro performance, Makena, 19" Andoya, Heat-pump, Nov'20 build, 23/12/20 delivery. Now with 2.1
hwhbev
Posts: 124
Joined: Sat Oct 17, 2020 6:48 pm

Post by hwhbev »

I wouldn't do it again with the 1st Edition as I'm not sure it was good value for money. We have definitely been beta testers. But with the range now available and with V2.0 (0783) software and above, I would definitely buy it now. I test drove the i3 for 24 hours about a year ago and I would say that the ID.3 is a better and more practical car for my needs.
pdk42
Posts: 40
Joined: Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:57 pm

Post by pdk42 »

Would I do it again? Probably. But the software issues are a terrible own goal on VW's part. I'm still amazed how VW got themselves into the mess they're in. Let me give you a taste (FYI, we've had the car since the end of Nov)...

  • Bugs - our car now has the 2.0 interim release pushed out in Dec, but there are still a number of random glitches I see on a day-to-day basis. Today it was losing all sound (incl the indicators), yesterday it was losing the park distance control system, last week it was the rear camera display going blank, week or so ago it was the auto function on the headlights that suddenly refused to work, and my wife one day reported that the mic stopped working on the hands-free when she made a call - she could hear the other party fine but all they got from her was silence. Then CarPlay sometimes stops working and needs me to reboot the infotainment system. I've also seen the adaptive cruise control mis-read speed limits (confusing mph with kph), and on one occasion I had the car auto-brake when it saw a pedestrian near the kerb but not actually a collision risk. I could go on, but you get the picture. These issues invariably go the next time you use the car, but it's frustrating wondering what won't work today!
  • Infotainment UI - the whole infotainment system is really a bit of a dog. It looks like a variant of what they've been using on Golfs etc for a while. It feels and looks "old", it's laggy, and it's not intuitive to use. They have added swipe features (e.g. to transition to alternative pages or pull down a control menu), but half the time it just ignores you. Today I had to swipe down a half dozen or so times to get the menu to appear on which you control things like Auto Hold. If you're used to modern mobile phone/tablet UIs, the VW system comes across as clunky and unfinished. It's like Symbian compared to iOS, or Windows 95 compared to MacOS. I have some hope they will improve the lagginess, but I think the basic UI is today what it will remain. It puts VW notably behind people like Tesla, Ford (with the Mach E), and Mercedes.
  • Mobile app - it's a mess. Not only is it very basic, but using it to control the car (e.g. turn heating on) is slow (sometimes things take minutes) and it fails 50% of the time. Someone has done snooping on the traffic between the app and the VW servers and it's plain that the problems are either in the back-end servers, the comms link between the servers and the car, or the car software itself. Basically, the whole app/server/car infrastructure just isn't working properly yet.
  • VW's testing - Release 2.0 introduced the feature to allow scheduled charging (e.g. overnight). However, it's just riddled with bugs. For example it will randomly reduce charging current or it'll sail past the scheduled starting time - both of which can leave the car way under-charged to what you asked for. Sometimes it just doesn't run the schedule at all and you wake up to the same state of charge as when you went to bed. Basically, it's just untested and so unusable. This strongly indicates to me that 2.0 is some branch of a dev build, rushed out to fix more serious bugs (and the release it replaces had owners complaining of airbag errors, dead 12V batteries, false alarm triggers).
Now all that sounds pretty damning - but to put some balance on it, none of it stops the car doing the essentials, and it actually does those very well. But it all points to rushed development, inadequate testing, and basically releasing code that's not production ready. It may also mean that the underlying software architecture has some weaknesses (but that's just speculation). I suspect by the middle of the year the software will eventually reach a production level but right now (even with the 2.0 interim release) it's still at beta quality. This is pretty inexcusable for a mainstream car from a major manufacturer.

However, trying to look past the software issues and take a more balanced view, I'd say this (as an experienced EV owner - a Tesla is our other car):

Pros:
  • The basic automotive engineering on the car is very good. It's well designed, it's well built (even panel gaps, great paint finish), and it has an excellent EV drivetrain. On many points, I'd rank it above the Tesla in this area. Top marks there.
  • Efficiency/range is good (apart from some questionable cold-weather issues which I think could well be software related - things like battery heating and heat pump control).
  • It's spacious, looks good, is comfortable and drives well. It feels well planted.
  • Performance is good - not Tesla power, but as good as a Golf GTI, which ain't bad.
  • The cabin is very quiet and refined. Notably better than the Tesla.
  • It's got reasonable features for the price. Matrix headlights are amazing if you can get that.
Cons:
  • The interior design is definitely showing the impact of cost-cutting. Too much use of hard plastic and the shiny black finish on the screen and the controls under it feels very cheap. Skimping on things like rear speakers on most models leaves a bad taste too.
  • The buttons under the screen and on the steering wheel are odd haptic-feedback touch buttons that just feel horrible to use. They sometimes auto-repeat when you don't want them to and they always feel unnatural to use. The buttons on our old Golf VI were 1000% better.
  • Lane Assist drives me crazy - constantly nudging the steering and although it can be turned off, it has to be turned off every time the car is put through an off/on sequence.
  • The controls under the touch screen are not illuminated meaning they are impossible to see at night unless you use a torch ! Massive design fail IMHO.
  • Rapid charging can hit 100kW, but the battery needs to be warm. There's no pre-conditioning yet in the software so unless you hammer it a bit with the throttle before you get to a rapid charger you'll be at 50kW or so, even on a unit capable of 100kW or more.
At the price (£30k ish depending on spec), I think the pros outweigh the cons by a decent enough margin - but I can't help feeling that VW, having got so much of the basic engineering right, managed to snatch a modest win from the jaws of a momentous success by the interior and the software issues. If these aren't big consideration for you, then I'd say go ahead! The basic car is very, very good. That's why I'd probably do it all again, but for just a little more effort on VW's part I'd be singing its praises from the rooftops.
stu-evs
Posts: 71
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2021 9:25 pm

Post by stu-evs »

As a counter to the above view on the 1st Edition - we picked our up heavily discounted at the end of the year - and only had to live with it on v1 software for a week or 2 - on v2.0 software now and not found any flaws to date (our dealership seemed to take their time and do a thorough update).....so would we do it again - absolutely!!! Even the app seems to be working fine for us and has done everything we've asked of it to date...maybe we're just lucky?!

This is a great car - and to pick it up with the discount we did, brand new rather than pre-registered, timing it right with the v2.0 software - it's a no brainer. I drive another EV too - the ID.3, from a fun to drive and handling perspective, eats it for breakfast - and I already thought my other EV was better than most others on the road! (Edited to add that the other EV in the house cost more than twice the price of the ID.3 - and the I've still chosen to jump in the ID.3 for the last few drives I've done!)

I actually think now is probably the perfect timing if you can pick up one of the deals going (although may now have to be pre-registered). I got into my other EV as an early adopter - I would say it took the other manufacturer a good 12-18 months to work through the same sort of software issues VW had with v1....and VW have managed to do that and get to v2 a lot quicker that the other guys - so I'm not so critical of VW here. I think they're doing well. The reality of product release in a fast world, as we live in today, is you have to release an MVP & then iterate - otherwise you're too late to market and miss the boat. This applies to all products - car or otherwise - and the world's only going to get faster.
ID.3 1st Edition

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sclrkuk
Posts: 32
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2021 6:00 pm

Post by sclrkuk »

Thanks for the really helpful replies. It's been interesting to read everyone's experiences, thoughts and pros and cons. Cheers.
VW ID.3 Life
hwhbev
Posts: 124
Joined: Sat Oct 17, 2020 6:48 pm

Post by hwhbev »

stu-evs wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 9:59 pm As a counter to the above view on the 1st Edition.....

Don’t get me wrong – I think it’s a really great car too. I love the features of the 1st Edition although I do wonder why the U.K. version is missing some of the other features that I hear our European neighbours got such as wireless phone charging, heat pump and rear speakers. I just question whether I got value for money given that I bought it in October (so probably paid more than you) and, as it became abundantly clear, the car was released with beta software. For me it will be six months by the time my car gets fully working software according to the specifications. Yes, I’ll be pleased when that happens but for me it makes the VFM even more questionable.
Deleted User 192

Post by Deleted User 192 »

hwhbev wrote: Wed Jan 20, 2021 10:19 am
stu-evs wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 9:59 pm As a counter to the above view on the 1st Edition.....
I do wonder why the U.K. version is missing some of the other features that I hear our European neighbours got such as wireless phone charging, heat pump and rear speakers.

You're sort of right - in most other countries there was a choice of 3 1st specs:

1st Pro
1st Plus
1st Max

Items such as wireless charging are ONLY on the 1st Max, which is more expensive.

The UK models are all of the 1st Plus spec - we didn't have the choice.
pdk42
Posts: 40
Joined: Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:57 pm

Post by pdk42 »

hwhbev wrote: Wed Jan 20, 2021 10:19 am
stu-evs wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 9:59 pm As a counter to the above view on the 1st Edition.....
I do wonder why the U.K. version is missing some of the other features that I hear our European neighbours got such as wireless phone charging, heat pump and rear speakers.
That's because the UK got the 1st Edition, Europe got that and also the 1st Edition Plus.
Deleted User 192

Post by Deleted User 192 »

pdk42 wrote: Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:27 pm That's because the UK got the 1st Edition, Europe got that and also the 1st Edition Plus.

As per my post above yours, the UK only got the 1st Plus while other countries also had the option of the more expensive 1st Max.
Deleted User 314

Post by Deleted User 314 »

For sure, yes.

I'm in Spain, we collected the "Pro Max" they call it here which has wireless charging etc.

For me there are 2 design faults and 1 annoyance.

Annoyance: the reverse dip mirror is insane, having to set it is OK but then having to turn the switch to R to enable it even when enabled in the options is a bit crazy.

Fault 1: Cannot open the boot if you reverse and then want to unload the car. There's no boot release, the remote doesn't work so you have to stop, lock, unlock or get out the car. No big deal you think, until you stop at lights, wife jumps out to get bags and then you cause chaos trying to figure out the combo.

Fault 2: More seriously - the lack of illumination on the heating/aircon under the touch screen is nonsensical. It's pitch black at night and you can easily overload your ears with volume or heat or both!

In the grand scheme of things, this is nothing. The car drives really well, accelerates like a beast, loads of space, and has good range.

I do find that a few too many public chargers here don't work with the iD3, not sure if the same in the UK.

Very happy with it indeed!
simonrg
Posts: 249
Joined: Wed Dec 23, 2020 11:40 pm

Post by simonrg »

Anduain wrote: Wed Jan 20, 2021 6:36 pm ....
Fault 1: Cannot open the boot if you reverse and then want to unload the car. There's no boot release, the remote doesn't work so you have to stop, lock, unlock or get out the car. No big deal you think, until you stop at lights, wife jumps out to get bags and then you cause chaos trying to figure out the combo.
....
So when your wife got out of the car, you unlocked the car and she pushed on the top of the Volkswagen symbol on the boot this didn't open the boot?
ID.3 Business Pro Performance + Heat Pump - 0564 (23/12/20) - 0783 (28/1/21) - 0792 (7/5/21) - 0910 (24/10/21) - 3.2 (6/7/23) - Hardware H20 - North Yorkshire
simonrg
Posts: 249
Joined: Wed Dec 23, 2020 11:40 pm

Post by simonrg »

Anduain wrote: Wed Jan 20, 2021 6:36 pm ....
Fault 2: More seriously - the lack of illumination on the heating/aircon under the touch screen is nonsensical. It's pitch black at night and you can easily overload your ears with volume or heat or both!
....
Agreed this is really silly, I find that even in the daytime the symbols are activated accidentally when using the touch screen, but at night absolutely useless.
ID.3 Business Pro Performance + Heat Pump - 0564 (23/12/20) - 0783 (28/1/21) - 0792 (7/5/21) - 0910 (24/10/21) - 3.2 (6/7/23) - Hardware H20 - North Yorkshire
Deleted User 314

Post by Deleted User 314 »

The VW logo was stuck rigidly in the “open” position so it’s not possible to open it. I think it’s a software fault as the logo doesn’t retract until you drive forward ONLY or get out of the car with the key.
Last edited by Deleted User 314 on Wed Jan 20, 2021 8:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Deleted User 314

Post by Deleted User 314 »

simonrg wrote: Wed Jan 20, 2021 7:38 pm
Anduain wrote: Wed Jan 20, 2021 6:36 pm ....
Fault 1: Cannot open the boot if you reverse and then want to unload the car. There's no boot release, the remote doesn't work so you have to stop, lock, unlock or get out the car. No big deal you think, until you stop at lights, wife jumps out to get bags and then you cause chaos trying to figure out the combo.
....
So when your wife got out of the car, you unlocked the car and she pushed on the top of the Volkswagen symbol on the boot this didn't open the boot?
The VW logo was stuck rigidly in the “open” position so it’s not possible to open it. I think it’s a software fault as the logo doesn’t retract until you drive forward ONLY or get out of the car with the key.
stu-evs
Posts: 71
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2021 9:25 pm

Post by stu-evs »

simonrg wrote: Wed Jan 20, 2021 7:40 pm
Anduain wrote: Wed Jan 20, 2021 6:36 pm ....
Fault 2: More seriously - the lack of illumination on the heating/aircon under the touch screen is nonsensical. It's pitch black at night and you can easily overload your ears with volume or heat or both!
....
Agreed this is really silly, I find that even in the daytime the symbols are activated accidentally when using the touch screen, but at night absolutely useless.
I think the intended reality is that the buttons were put there as some form of compromise to the design anyway - from a design point of view they wouldn’t exist and every one would just use the voice control. To be fair I’ve not used those buttons once since owning.... always use voice control or steering wheel buttons.
ID.3 1st Edition

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Deleted User 192

Post by Deleted User 192 »

Anduain wrote: Wed Jan 20, 2021 6:36 pm Annoyance: the reverse dip mirror is insane, having to set it is OK but then having to turn the switch to R to enable it even when enabled in the options is a bit crazy.

Fault 1: Cannot open the boot if you reverse and then want to unload the car. There's no boot release, the remote doesn't work so you have to stop, lock, unlock or get out the car. No big deal you think, until you stop at lights, wife jumps out to get bags and then you cause chaos trying to figure out the combo.

Fault 2: More seriously - the lack of illumination on the heating/aircon under the touch screen is nonsensical. It's pitch black at night and you can easily overload your ears with volume or heat or both!

Annoyance: Disagree, I would only ever need that function when parallel parking, I’ve used it maybe 4 times in 3 months.

Fault 1: Doesn’t the badge return to it’s regular drive position if you close the reversing camera image screen?

Fault 2: Not a fault. This is by design, the Golf 8 works exactly the same way. I use the steering wheel controls for volume, and easily got used to only changing the temperatures with no illumination.
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