Totally dead

All Volkswagen ID.3 related discussions
dilbert
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2020 9:51 pm

Post by dilbert »

still don't have my car back. Dealer advises that the control unit has been replaced but that hasn't solved the issue. When I asked what my car was doing I was advised "nothing"! They are waiting for VW UK to come back to them with advice on what to do next. All a bit concerning really.

Oh, and the software version 0783 that my replacement ID3 has installed doesn't solve the problem of the alarm going off in the middle of the night. Was woken up at 01:45 Monday morning with the alarm going off.

Starting to miss my GTi......

Jono
Posts: 143
Joined: Tue Feb 23, 2021 9:56 pm

Post by Jono »

I really feel for you, it’s really an appalling situation. I had a bad experience with a BMW X5 a number of years ago - constantly in the workshop but never fully fixed. In the end I kicked up such a stink, BMW, provided me with a brand new car.

My advise would be to write formally to your dealer (copped to VW) setting out your position and making it clear that if it’s not resolved within xx days that you will take further actions. Can’t guarantee it will work, but it did for me
dilbert
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2020 9:51 pm

Post by dilbert »

spoke to the dealer again today. So the story is they did a software upgrade and the control unit bust. They ordered another control unit and installed it. The car was working fine but then the 'recall' software update (his words) was required before they could release the car back to me. They did the software update and it fell over part way through. Car dead again and another control unit is on order and this should be with the dealer by next Friday (19th). They then they need to fit it, update the car with the latest version of the software and hopefully that should be an end to it. We'll see........
Jono
Posts: 143
Joined: Tue Feb 23, 2021 9:56 pm

Post by Jono »

This type of thing really doesn’t fill me with confidence - it’s a sad state when a software upgrade actually breaks the hardware
mediumbird
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2021 10:23 am

Post by mediumbird »

Deep joy! I have joined the totally dead 12V battery club.....The day before it was due to go in for its first software upgrade. Currently awaiting roadside assistance. I had charged it up to 90% yesterday afternoon, and not sure why it should be dead. Interestingly, if I am in the car when its charging, I turn the AC off, but there was still a gentle hum from somewhere in the front and Im wondering if that is what the problem is-something isn't powering down properly and keeps on going even when you exit the car and lock it.

Please be patient with me, as I am a newbie, and not that technical minded. I'm assuming if I open the car with the key, that it won't trigger any alarms? If I were to purchase a 12v battery charger-then what is the best to get?

I have suggested to VW support that they should perhaps provide us beta testers(as that's what we appear to be) with a complimentary 12v battery charger! perhaps even have some sort of 12v remote monitoring system...or even give us all complimentary roadside assistance beyond the usual 1 year....Won't be holding my breath on that one.
Have had numerous error message on various parts of the system over my 4 months of ownership. all of which rectify and non of which VW support could help me with, but this is the first one that has completely disabled the system.

On another subject. Does anyone get a gentle electric shock from the car after charging it up? Seems to happen to me quite regularly after Ive disconnected the charger. Wondering if it's just me....
Last edited by mediumbird on Mon Apr 12, 2021 12:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Deleted User 192

Post by Deleted User 192 »

If you're on the old software (pre 2.0 aka 0783), charging the "drive" batteries won't do anything to the 12V unless you have the car "started" at the time.

When my 12V was too low the AA guy gave me a process to go through after he had boosted it and brought it back to life:

  • Start the car with the button on the side of the steering column
  • Leave the car unlocked
  • Plug it in to charge
  • Leave it for at least 30 minutes
He advised me to repeat that process twice more - later that evening and the following morning - after doing that all was fine and I had no repeat.
mediumbird
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2021 10:23 am

Post by mediumbird »

Yes, on version 0564. Just dropped the car off at the garage for its software upgrade after roadside recovery got me going with a wee 12V boost. Will see if the upgrade makes any difference.....
Amazing number of errors after the 12V boost-would make you terrified to actually drive it if I hadn't read about that on this forum. Thanks
Deleted User 192

Post by Deleted User 192 »

Once it's on 2.0 or later the car monitors the 12V and tops it up from the "drive" batteries if needed, in theory you shouldn't get a repeat.
thefordprefect
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2021 2:59 pm

Post by thefordprefect »

I measured a voltage of 2.94 volts on the 12 volt battery whilst in our drive. To allow the battery to fall to this level is never advised – as an electronic design engineer, I cannot conceive how there was not a low voltage shut down in the discharge path electronics long before this voltage was reached!:

from - Battery 101 Three Things Need Know Lead Acid Batteries | Northeast Battery Blog
“This is a hard and fast NO. By fully discharging your lead acid battery, or even discharging it below 80% of its rated capacity, you could damage the battery.
The belief that a battery needed to be fully discharged before recharging goes back to the memory effect issue. (See question 1.) Since that is no longer an issue (and never was an issue with lead acid batteries) there is not a need to fully discharge.
By discharging a lead acid battery to below the manufacturer’s stated end of life discharge voltage you are allowing the polarity of some of the weaker cells to become reversed. This causes permanent damage to those cells and prevents the battery from ever being recharged.”

The AA engineer who took the vehicle to dealer (I did not want to drive with errors on brakes, steering and 6 other things) a distance of 10 miles informed us that the battery had not recharged during the trip – still read below 12 volts, This may be because the battery charge circuit was non functional or the battery had been damaged by over discharge.

Beware early death of 12 volt battery if the voltage has fallen below recommended minimum!
Folkramfer
Posts: 64
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:23 pm

Post by Folkramfer »

I'm a bit bemused as to why you need a lead acid battery. Its adding all that extra weight and taking up space. If vw felt the need for extra electric capacity why did they not put in a slightly higher rated main battery. I'm sure any need for reserve power, segregation of supply and voltage differences could have been handled electronically. Oops! VW aren't too good at electronics these days.
OllyExeterID3
Posts: 67
Joined: Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:45 pm

Post by OllyExeterID3 »

Folkramfer wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 7:31 am I'm a bit bemused as to why you need a lead acid battery. Its adding all that extra weight and taking up space. If vw felt the need for extra electric capacity why did they not put in a slightly higher rated main battery. I'm sure any need for reserve power, segregation of supply and voltage differences could have been handled electronically. Oops! VW aren't too good at electronics these days.
Agree with this - I wonder if there is a practical reason why a lead acid battery is needed. Any engineers/electricians who can shed light on this? Not sure it is to do with battery chemistry/design that means that auxiliaries are better run from lead acid or not.

Either way, we got through out 2.1 update the other day so fingers crossed this will never be a problem for us. But, as we rarely use the car daily, I think I am going to be always a little worried!
G43FAN

Post by G43FAN »

All BEVs have a 12volt battery even the gods that are Tesla are only just looking at moving to Lithium based batteries to replace the Lead Acid.. It's not a VW thing.

1. To ensure that in the event of a main battery failure there is still braking and hazard functionality.
2. To trigger the main battery back to life otherwise it would have to be on all the time
3. To avoid a vampire drain from electrical systems killing the main battery completely
and others..
HeidiFlowerpt Driver
Posts: 251
Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2020 2:30 pm

Post by HeidiFlowerpt Driver »

Also I believe the electronics are run from the 12V battery rather than the HV array.
ID.3 1st Edition Manganese Grey - called Heidi Flowerpot
thefordprefect
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2021 2:59 pm

Post by thefordprefect »

the vehicle battery is around 400 volts fully charged. they would need a medium power convertor to reduce this voltage down to the 12 volts/3volts/5volts to run the electronics and lights. This may introduce failures as 400volts is/was a tricky voltage for most commercial electronics. And perhaps more relevant would be safety of breaking steering etc if the 400v battery is depleted. there is also power loss in the convertor and possibly having to route high voltage dc lines round the vehicle..
I understand the need for the battery. I do not understand why they cannot maintain the battery and why they cannot switch everything off when the vehicle is off. When I was working on power assisted steering electronics there were very tough specifications on the off (quiescent) current (less than 1/1000 of Amp (1mA) I think!). The power assistance requirement was around 50Amps so that would be a heavy load for a convertor!
Folkramfer
Posts: 64
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:23 pm

Post by Folkramfer »

I reckon the systems are just not developed enough to rely on single power source. I'm sure that we'll see the demise of an auxiliary battery in the not too distant future.
Sindidziwa
Posts: 84
Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2020 4:06 pm

Post by Sindidziwa »

scott28tt wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 2:19 pm Once it's on 2.0 or later the car monitors the 12V and tops it up from the "drive" batteries if needed, in theory you shouldn't get a repeat.
Unfortunately, my 12V problems have only arisen _after_ being upgraded to 2.1 (0792) - secondtimme showing 'drive to charge' message despite driving 80+ miles yesterday...
Sheila
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue May 11, 2021 10:24 pm

Post by Sheila »

After 7 months of having the ID.3 1st Plus with sw 2.1 (0792), it would seem that I am now having issues with the battery. I don't know for sure because I did not get any warnings and had even driven it with no issues over the 2 days prior, but when I unlocked the door and sat in it Tuesday morning, I could not shift it to D/B or R (I did double tap on the brakes as usual to start it, but nothing happened this time). In the end, we got the road assist truck to come by and tow it to the VW workshop that is luckily just a 5 min walk from where I live. Before towing it away, the road assist mechanic tried to disconnect the 12V battery and reconnect it again. This created all imaginable error codes to show up, and though it went back to normal in the end, the car stubbornly still remained in (P)ark.

Due to Ascension Day this week, VW said they can get back to me only on Monday, so yeah...let's see what they say. My car has been to the workshop around 7-8 times already, mainly because they still can't seem to get the keyless access feature to work (the only keyless thing I can do is to lock the door by touching the handle). So hopefully they will be able to fix these two issues when they return the car back. Good thing my car is leased, so if all kinds of issues continue to persist, I can stop the leasing contract after September. It is otherwise a fantastic car to drive in, so I don't hope it comes to that.
G4XUR
Posts: 46
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2021 11:15 pm

Post by G4XUR »

Having suffered the same issues I am concluding the battery (12v) has become knackered with abnormal discharges below the battery manufacturers stated limits on numerous times, which after after the 2.1 update; is capacity degraded even though 2.1ensures the 12v battery gets a little charge when the HV battery is being charged. I measured it across the battery terminals as over 16v which suggests the battery impedance is far higher than a normal battery specification (knackered 12v battery). I got mine swapped out for a new one a month ago and all is now well. Well, I used the ID3 at the weekend and next time will be tomorrow!! hope all is ok! VW have lost their reliability reputation with this one and the ID4. Such a shame for VW as was.
Matthewwoolf
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2021 8:29 pm

Post by Matthewwoolf »

To add my experience here today I had the 2nd occurrence of a dead 12v battery and the AA had to recover the car.

I’m gutted and really upset about this issue and going to be engaging a lawyer to try and understand how to resolve this issue. Ideally I want a return snd refund. Unless there is a proper fix to constantly think your car will not start makes it unfit for purpose.
ID3 Life Pro - 2021
Matthewwoolf
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2021 8:29 pm

Post by Matthewwoolf »

As an update to my post I have now had VW confirm there is a part that needs replacing ( I believe this to be a transformer between the 12v battery and the car). It was due to arrive today however VW UK put a stop to the delivery stating that the part is faulty and its going through a re-design or re-programming (they were not clear). Either way I wont get another update until later in the week but clearly there is an issue here!
ID3 Life Pro - 2021
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